Wayne Marshall's talk at Harvard's Berkman Center for Internet and Society, and back chat transcript today:
The Unstable Platforms and Uneasy Peers of Brave New World Music
http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/events/luncheon/2010/12/marshallThe actual video is posted.
Here are Harvard's Berkman Center for Internet and Society senior fellow, Ethan Zuckerman's observations about Wayne's talk:
http://www.ethanzuckerman.com/blog/2010/12/15/wayne-marshall-on-nu-whirled-music-and-my-thoughts-too/Known Networks ChatZilla error Connected Networks
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Good morning!
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Just started watching, should be interesting.
Here's Wayne Marshall's blog: http://wayneandwax.com/
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who's here?
hi doc
Hi Doc!
Here's Audacity - the free audio program Wayne just mentioned, for which you also need 'Lame' - at the open, editable, World University and School's free Educational Software Page - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/Educational_Software#Audio_Editor_and_Recorder (where there's a lot of other software these kids probably use ...)
hey
Had to go fill a parking meter
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When I had podcasting fantasies, I developed a way of recognizing my "um"s on Audacity, and gag-edited them out of whole files. Now I'm thinking my "um"s are my vernacular watermarks.
http://wayneandwax.com/
http://wayneandwax.com/?p=2913
In a way, Wayne is exploring an anthropology of creativity vis-a-vis digital technologies ...
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right
The challenges of access to platforms, and negotiating commercialism, would change with a kind of National Digital Library of software (like the Tool Lending Library in Berkeley), which a number of other people in the building there in Cambridge are actively working on ...
For example - http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/newsroom/digital_public_library
I hope the open, editable, World University and School's free Educational Software Page - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/Educational_Software (where there's a lot of other software these kids probably use ...) and WUaS's Library Resources page might be part of this Library project, as well as help these kids explore creativity - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/Library_Resources
Years ago, I refered to readio as "snow on the water." That's when all of it was streamed, unless you troubled to record it on a tape cassette or whatever. The default was: here and gone. Live, but also instantly dead. Little was also spooled onto files or otherwise saved off. With the Net, we have these traditional media -- audio and video -- in file as well as stream form. In fact, files are the new default. Yet there'
snow-on-water effect still, only unevenly and in slow motion. Stuff may be up on YouTube, but not permanently . In fact, noting on the Web is permanent. We rent our domain names. Things pause there on their way to oblivion, kind of like we all do, on our journey between birth and death. So, now we have snow on ice. But the ice melts.
good stuff, Scott.
I tink we're the only ones here. Funny, in years past, the IRC would have up to dozens of people.
I've added Wayne's talk here already to Webnographers.org's Anthropology of Youtube section: http://www.webnographers.org/index.php?title=Videos#Anthropology_of_YouTube (Webnographers is a wiki bibliography for virtual ethnography).
Yes, Doc
Thanks. I think I'll save off this IRC, and make it snow on ice for Media Berkman, when they put up the webcast.
:)
Here's the Ethnomusicology page at WUaS ... http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/Ethnomusicology ... where Wayne's blog is also linked ... for open teaching and learning ...
This you? http://scottmacleod.com/
Using Wayne's talk - "The Unstable Platforms and Uneasy Peers of Brave New World Music" - how would he distinguish between World Music and Ethnomusicology as umbrella terms for this study?
Just looking to link to something.
Yes
Anyone in the Second LIfe iteration of this event
k. I'll ask.
Thanks!
I doubt it., but I dunno.
I'll go into SL and check regirob
I was there but didn't find the stream
My character in SL lapsed out.
I was only there for Berkman anyway, hate to say. My kid took over early on, then lost interest.
I didn't last week either ... didn't even find the screen in SL on Berkman Island ... seemed to have disappeared or moved ... and the building on the other side of the island which now mentions streaming video was inaccessible:)
ok no problem
I find SL fascinating for potential classrooms for World University and School, for example - you can voice chat with 40 avatars at the same time as you text chat, while streaming video in, and you can save the transcript ...
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Here's WUaS ... http://worlduniversity.wikia.com (like Wikipedia with MIT Open Course Ware)
Welcome Ethan!
Hi scott
what was the question from the backchannel?
Ethan, et. al., so it doesn't scroll off...
scottmacleod: Using Wayne's talk - "The Unstable Platforms and Uneasy Peers of Brave New World Music" - how would he distinguish between World Music and Ethnomusicology as umbrella terms for this study?
(Do any of the kids who make music do so in Second Life, or other virtual worlds? - haven't heard Wayne mention this).
It may be too hard to post in SL
One would need to link out to a service provider
unless you have access to a streaming server
maybe a machinma
SL adds a level of complexity but it's still pretty easy ... but youtube etc ... make music video sharing very easy ... in a focused way ..
Interesting backstory:
http://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2010/02/17/musicblogocide-2010-the-blame-game/
posted to Youtube
Machinimas add a creative element
Thanks!
In what ways could Wayne see an open, editable World University Music School - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/World_University_Music_School - potentially in all instruments in world (add a number instrument and teaching/learning videos from youtube) for open, teaching, learning and jamming online?
* More clearly: In what ways could Wayne see an open, editable World University Music School - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/World_University_Music_School thriving - potentially with all instruments in the world (add any instrument and/or teaching/learning videos from youtube, etc.) for open teaching, learning and jamming (e.g. Skype jamming) online?
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Does Secondlife have a halflife? Meaning its decline is asymptotic.
this is off topic, but it will be interesting when Facebook plateaus and starts to decline.
I am interested in looking at the content of these videos as ethnographic material especiall the people in the background.
and is it niche at the same time, as Wayne mentioned ...
Is TV a good historical example and precedent for SL and FB ?
What's th e little animated icon in Wayne's browser next to the location bar?
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"That thing's been done. It's so five minutes ago..."
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http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/22/fashion/22jerking.html on screen now
I wonder if just appearingin the NYTimes and having MTV's name dropped had chilling effects. Like, it was over as it began
thanks for the link, doc
Does MTV still have music videos? I don't have cable, so I dunno.
Ethanz: four things: 1 takes over 2 jihadest rejection, 3. curry, fusion. 4. "Nice culture. I've got one of my own. This is 3. Ethan, correct that, if you like.
Here's where you'll find this video plus transcript from today's talk by Wayne: http://scott-macleod.blogspot.com/2010/12/hawaiian-monk-seal-wayne-marshalls-talk.html
(Am I the only one not entirely comfortable having the transcript of these backchannels posted on the Web?)
I am fine with it. It adds the conversation that people will miss if there are not online for the live stream
gives richer content to the lecture
http://davequam.wordpress.com/2010/02/03/i-wanna-learn-how-to-footwork/
It also adds resources and contributes to the conversation ... but I'm happy to remove it ...
Yes, but I will participate more, um, gently if I know it's being posted.
would probably be a good idea if we talked through the idea of posting the IRC before deciding we're going to - we haven't posted it in the past
That is a good point.
I'm registering discomfort, not demanding takedown. But thanks for the offer, scott.
Yes ... sounds good ...
Scott, I'm not suggesting the whole backchannel dialogue, but rather harvesting the questions and the links.
It could be edited to exclude participants who decline
I just dont want to lose the good stuff.
makes sense ...
Thank you all.
will do
Thank you Wayne!
Some of these backchannels (not today's) are robust, raunchy, and not ready for prime time.
Thank you for the backchannel
I am ambivalent about this. Why it's just like WikiLeaks!
'
:)
Perhaps it should be stated at the start of the program, just like it was for the people in the room.
Agreed, Rob
Anyway, thanks again. Regina Roberts Stanford Univeristy - Librarian
University
Welcome, Regina ... nice to meet you here.
Yes, this was a very interesting lecture and I am so glad that my questions got asked
Do you participate here occasionally or regularly, Regina?
this is the first time
I am working on a paper on this topic, but related to self-production and self-publishing in lusophone Africa
my colleague sent me the link
Yes ... having the possibility to participate in the conversation remotely is great - and it's possibly more likely here in this back channel than others.
Yes, it is very rich.
interesting ... lusophone Africa?
Yes - Portuguese Speaking Africa - I noticed Wayne mentioned Kuduru
that is one of my examples as well
I see ...
There is so much information in the background of those music videos, daily life, intimate views of the household
little brothers and sisters standing in the wings
other conversations.
The web is a remarkable resource ... have you found anything in virtual worlds on lusophone Africa, by any chance?
the problem is getting at the details of the time, who, and the ethical considerations of using the material to inform a view
about virtual worlds... not much for SL type of things...I have foudn allot of Angolan art, music, poetry online
from other sources than YouTube, but YouTube is prominent
vimeo has some
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the production, the producers are in the diaspora....living in portugal, Amsterdam etc
I'm writing an actual / virtual ethnography of Harbin Hot Springs in northern California - intending to build a virtual Harbin in Open Sim or Second Life - but recently found some great online videos
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thanks, all. saved off. I'll be gentle. Punching out...
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Important questions ... if material makes it on to the web, what are the ethics of re-
posting and thinking/writing about it, anthropologically?
I don't now about Harbin Hot Springs, but now I will look it up.
Bye, Doc!
http://harbin.org
thank you
http://scott-macleod.blogspot.com/search/label/Harbin%20ethnography
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and other Harbin tags on this blog are some resources ...
Do you know Laura Hubbard at Stanford? ... also an Africanist, she might say, I think ...
Yes I do
I live near Berkeley, and know her from Cal
And how did you find out about this even?
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hi all
Here's a video of Watsu (water shiatsu) at Harbin (pretty well done) - http://scott-macleod.blogspot.com/2010/11/manatee-baby-waters-of-life-documentary.html - and a machinima on "The Making of Harbin Hot Springs as Ethnographic Field Site in Open Simulator or Second Life"
Hi Schock
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hey scottmacleod, ethanz, amarashar, weinbergerd
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Hello Schock. Scottmacleod: Did you make the machinima?
everyone sounds so cheery :) hi regirob
Regina, I participated in a class with Harvard Law Professor Charlie Nesson in 2006 on Harvard's virtual island called "CyberOne: Law in the Court of Public Opinion" and have gone to a number of Berkman events in Cambridge, and stayed in touch on line, from California.
argh, who is eating the mic
Yes, I made the machinima with a friend.
:)
I've also taught a class, "Information Technology and Society," on Harvard's virtual island for about 6 semesters.
Wow.
http://socinfotech.pbworks.com/
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I enjoy teaching in virtual worlds ...
have you been to Stanford University Library Island?
We are actively building out special collections exhibits for use in teaching
Yes, I visit it occasionally ... I enjoy the sim ...
great
Are you familiar with the Exploratorium SL exhibits? They've done very innovative things with SL, making physics' exhibits 'work' in SL.
http://www.splo.org/SLCC2009.htm
Have not seen that - I would like to
What are you focusing on with the special collections exhibits?
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http://xkcd.com/802_large/
trained in the art of email :)
linking the digital resources to the library catalog and additional resources as well as internet sites
yes - do send me email
glad to see opensimulator gaining steam
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was always bizarre to see educational institutions piling on to a proprietary VR platform w/SL
will do
agreed schock
now that it's come time to pay the piper, hopefully most will make the smart move away :)
Very nice graphic, Doc! - http://xkcd.com/802_large/ :)
maybe we need a netiquette version of http://teachparentstech.org
http://teachkidsnetiquette.org ?
http://education.qld.gov.au/library/edhistory/topics/manners.html
socsearls: thx
LOL
http://education.qld.gov.au/library/img/edhistory/topics/goodmanners.jpg
too small, but it's there.
LOL http://www.netmanners.com/
In text: http://www.cai.org/bible-studies/our-hidden-history-good-manners
Interesting why email is informal since it is more public than personal letters -- more recipients
http://www.dilbert.com/2010-12-11/ and http://www.dilbert.com/2010-12-13/ The former being context and the latter being manners.
I wonder if in part it's because email came into an office ecology where the more formal niches were already occupied (e.g., by memos)
It isn
't just interoperablity. It's usefulness and adoptability. It's why SMTP, POP3 and IMAP won over X.400.
didn't it really grow up in uniersities?
universities
I think something has to do with the simple ease of creating and sending vs handwriting a letter, addressing an envelope, etc.
And why HTML won over SGML. In the latter cases, proprietary silo-ing became problems to be solved with simple adoptable no-friction alternatives.
jbessen, good point. But email also has a higher chance of being embarrassing, which would make you think it'd be taken as a more formal channel
islamic netiquette
http://www.sydneymuslimyouth.com/smyforum/showthread.php?t=1369
Interesting how much manners matter to religious fundamentalists.
Here, also, are some resources at Webnographers.org on email: http://www.webnographers.org/index.php?title=Papers#Email_and_Virtual_Ethnography . See, for example, the history of email by Van Vleck, although he only focuses on POP and SMTP - and mostly in the 1960s.
docsearls: or corporate tools
yes.
docsearls: or families
(Check, to the Videos' page, as well as the Books' page).
weinbergerd :)
We're re-writing etiquette books as user guides
same thing
heh http://www.dtcc.edu/cs/rfc1855.html
I come from these people... http://www.flickr.com/photos/docsearls/179573983/in/set-72157625369496438/ ... who taught, literally, "Children are to be seen and not heard." This became embedded in compulsory education, corporatism (see Weinberger on Fort Business, in Cluetrain chapter 5) and other regions of Severe Practice, including religious fundamentalism.
TBL's EULA
What hath God tweeted...
:)
Google should have a Google Was for dead projects.
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"Just had sushi for lunch. What hath god wraught"
Is email a medium or a practice?
docsearls: yes.
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http://protocol.by/hugo
The numbered items are protocols, no?
is each protocol set (such as email's smtp, pop3 and imap) its own "medium"? Could be that how the Internet Protocol Suite is actually a collection of media that have been absorbed by universal transport and addressing protocols? Just a thought.
*clap clap*
Maybe nothing is broken, but everything is partially fixed.
* schock is on protocol.by, trying to find the 'IRC' button
protocol.by needs an 'other' button at least
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for users to create their own channel description
'smoke signal, carrier pigeon, IRC etc'
the problem isn't email. It's the inbox.
Thanks, all. Fun to join this. Gotta go pick up a kid. See ya this evening.
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had the same problem, schock. I prefer to be contacted by telepathy, then email. Couldn't find the button
ethanz_ :) http://protocol.by/schock
I actually tell my students which days I read their email.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/06/youth-interrupt-sex-to-an_n_525839.html
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oops
protocol issue, schock?
:-)
ctrl W in the wrong window :P
* schock has the same experience w/linkedin
has the same experience w/linkedin
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bye all
jim b says bye
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hello
anyone here?
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(http://scott-macleod.blogspot.com/2010/12/hawaiian-monk-seal-wayne-marshalls-talk.html - December 14, 2010)
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